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George Faller [00:00:30]:

The following content is not suitable for children premature ejaculation. What do we do? Help.

Laurie Watson [00:00:40]:

I’m going to help. I got lots of suggestions. Welcome to foreplay sex therapy. I’m Dr. Lori Watson, your sex therapist.

George Faller [00:00:51]:

And I’m George Fowley, a couple’s therapist.

Laurie Watson [00:00:54]:

We are here to talk about sex.

George Faller [00:00:56]:

Our mission is to help couples talk about sex in ways that incorporate their body, their mind, and their hearts.

Laurie Watson [00:01:04]:

And we have a little bit of fun doing it.

George Faller [00:01:05]:

Right, g. I’m out representing the men out here. We can talk about sex, and I.

Laurie Watson [00:01:11]:

Am representing women who can also talk about sex. And to help them feel comfortable talking.

George Faller [00:01:15]:

About sex, listen and let’s change some relationships.

Laurie Watson [00:01:19]:

Don’t forget to check out Uberlube.com with the coupon foreplay. It really helps us to support the podcast and keep delivering free content. Thanks so much.

George Faller [00:01:28]:

Well, this is where we need the expert sex therapist.

Laurie Watson [00:01:31]:

Yes.

George Faller [00:01:32]:

What’s the number? About 40% of men suffer from premature ejaculation at some point.

Laurie Watson [00:01:38]:

Absolutely.

George Faller [00:01:38]:

At some point. So this is par for the course. I think most men can relate to at some periods in their life of coming before they want to come.

Laurie Watson [00:01:48]:

Yes, and most men, especially early in their sexual life, have had an experience of premature ejaculation. It’s just so exciting to have early to have intercourse for the first or second time. I think it can set up anxiety, though. Some men get anxious about that. Just for the record, guys, that’s totally normal if you’re having first time sex. I mean, that’s going to blow your mind. Probably going to come quickly. That’s no big deal.

George Faller [00:02:16]:

Well, I want to start off by at least giving some accurate facts, okay. Because I think a lot of people have some bad information because of our culture and what we see on TV. But premature ejaculation is defined as having sex for less than a minute.

Laurie Watson [00:02:33]:

Right.

George Faller [00:02:34]:

The average love making is only three to seven minutes. I think it’s 4.5. I mean, that’s kind of mind blowing if you think about the pressure that so many men feel that the great lovers are hours of intercourse. And so many female partners don’t want hours of intercourse, right, because they love the experience, but a lot of them can’t have an orgasm through intercourse. So this myth that you’re supposed to be making love, intercourse for hours, I think we need to set the record straight on that one. Laurie, what do you think?

Laurie Watson [00:03:08]:

I think so. Absolutely. I think ten to 30 minutes of sex would kind of wear a woman out. Her vaginal tissue is kind of sensitive, so she may lose lubrication. So suddenly it doesn’t feel as good. And, I mean, it can be too much. This is one of the problems on the other side of issues, which is delayed ejaculation. But I think men get the idea that they’re supposed to last forever, and that that’s good for her, and for most women, not so good.

George Faller [00:03:42]:

And when we talk about love making for hours, that’s foreplay and then some intercourse, and then some oral sex, followed by more foreplay. I mean, there’s so many things that are happening for hours that’s really around, hey, let’s take a break and have some strawberries, and let’s get back to kiss. I mean, that’s what I think of about when couples talk about hours of sex, not hours of intercourse. That’s like an aerobic workout.

Laurie Watson [00:04:06]:

Yeah, exactly. Burn some calories.

George Faller [00:04:09]:

But for a man that has that as the goal, I’m supposed to have intercourse for an hour straight. If they have two minutes of sex and all of a sudden they feel like an utter failure, well, guess what? That two minutes is pretty close to where you should be.

Laurie Watson [00:04:23]:

Yeah, exactly. And I think asking her, what do you like? Some women do climax with sexual intercourse, and so if they are with a partner who has premature ejaculation, it could be really disappointing. Or if they need it a little bit longer. I mean, it’s so easily fixable. Can I just say that six times?

George Faller [00:04:46]:

Yes, please.

Laurie Watson [00:04:47]:

Premature ejaculation is easily fixable. It truly is.

George Faller [00:04:51]:

Without all these shots or taking medicine.

Laurie Watson [00:04:54]:

No.

George Faller [00:04:55]:

It’s numbing things out.

Laurie Watson [00:04:57]:

No, you need a partner who’s willing, and I think that this is one of the difficulties we know in the negative sexual cycle, is that there’s a meaning that gets assigned to the premature ejaculation. And most of the time, if a guy comes too quickly, maybe he feels ashamed of that. He feels like he let her down in some way. Maybe he doesn’t realize and this is so common, he doesn’t realize that he could still give her an orgasm through clitoral stimulation. And so he just rolls over, feels embarrassed, gets out of bed, acts angry, but he’s really angry at himself. And so for her, the sex act suddenly becomes fraught with danger, danger, danger. This is a point of disconnection. So do I really want to do this? And pretty soon, they both start turning away from sex itself because it’s going to end in this disappointment.

George Faller [00:05:55]:

And this disconnect is so important. I’m going to highlight that one. Laurie. So notice Laurie’s calling the problem the disconnection that happens in that moment. If the partner has premature ejaculation and then feels so ashamed and rolls over, it’s the break. I mean, here you are in a moment of intimacy. Now whack, you get hit with disconnection. How could that not be a threat to her brain? How could it not feel unfair? And then she protests, which is going to just feed his shame. And now the negative cycle has taken this moment over. It has won. The problem isn’t the premature ejaculation, it’s the disconnection. How do we help couples to see that it’s okay? You can figure it out. You can still stay in connection. I mean, we’re going to figure out how to beat it. I love that Lori’s saying this is treatable, right? You can do something. But even if in the midst of not being able to do something, if you can stay in connection, you’re going to be fine.

Laurie Watson [00:06:50]:

Exactly. And I want to put it the other way, too. The other part of this cycle is maybe the man has premature ejaculation, and the woman really does want longer intercourse. I mean, intercourse is an amazing feeling. And so if he isn’t in her long enough or doesn’t get to be in her because he climaxes outside the vagina and she’s frustrated and maybe talks to him like, hey, this is really important to me. We got to get this fixed, and maybe he’s resistant. Usually shame is the resistance, right? But over time, if he doesn’t do anything about it, he doesn’t talk to his doctor, he doesn’t go to a sex therapist, and it continues and continues and continues. These couples come in to see me, and she is, at that point, really frustrated, really enraged. And the meaning can be he doesn’t care about me. He doesn’t care about my pleasure. He doesn’t care about what’s important to me. It’s like, I understand he’s got blocks, but then why doesn’t he do something about it?

George Faller [00:07:50]:

What you don’t recognize is he has tried to do lots of things about it. I haven’t met one man at his premature ejaculation that doesn’t want to fix it. Unfortunately, the information out there and how to fix it isn’t so accurate. I remember at the firehouse, somehow this came up. One of the senior guys are like, hey, listen, do you know all 52 presidents at that time or how many there were? And the guy’s like, what are you talking about? Why are you bringing up presidents? That’s all I do is I try to remember the president’s names and put them in order. And when I do that, before you know it, five minutes has gone by, and I’m like and everyone else is like, all right, sounds like good advice. Now that I’ve immersed myself more in this kind of sexual conversation, it’s terrible advice. It’s encouraging people to not be present. It’s encouraging them to go into their head, to go towards that disconnection. It’s trying to solve a problem, but it’s missing the root of the problem, which is this fear, this anxiety that Laurie’s really highlighting. But how do we deal with the anxiety instead of trying to avoid it?

Laurie Watson [00:08:55]:

I want to say something about that it’s deeroticizing the moment it’s actually creating. For the male, that strategy less pleasure, less eroticism. And it feels like a paradox because what we really want him to do is to think very sexy thoughts so that he gets more pleasure and be able to stay in his body in a highly erotic moment that will help. And so this other strategy, it’s age old, right? If I just think about something else a patient of mine said, I just think about dead kittens. And if I think about dead kittens and then he goes but then I start to lose my erection and I got to think about hot women. And so it’s dead kittens.

George Faller [00:09:39]:

Hot women that’s some ride. Before you know it, the dead kittens are with the hot women. It’s really disturbing.

Laurie Watson [00:09:48]:

Then we start George Fowler’s mind.

George Faller [00:09:52]:

So can we again, I think a lot of what we try to do here is give good information, but even more importantly is dispelling bad information. So if you find yourself trying to cure your premature ejaculation by dissociating not being present, not the solution, even if it works, stretches you out another 30 seconds. The cost of stretching you out is it’s feeding the very thing that causes the problem in the first place.

Laurie Watson [00:10:19]:

Yeah. And the problem basically is anxiety driven. We feel men climax for two reasons for erotic pleasure or for anxiety. Both erotic thoughts and anxiety make him apt to orgasm quickly. So what we want is for his erotic thoughts, his erotic experience to make him climax, not his anxiety. So we kind of have a protocol for how to resolve know? I think most couples, if I see.

George Faller [00:10:52]:

A lot of our listeners taking out that pen right now, trying to write some things down. Let’s go, Lori, break it down for us.

Laurie Watson [00:10:58]:

I have an article on it in Psychology Today. Six months for couples to cure premature ejaculation together. We know, George, that getting the couples to this moment is kind of the real work of therapy because there’s pain and there’s anxiety about talking about it. Maybe they haven’t had success. They’ve made things up in their head. They’ve assigned meaning to their partner’s behavior. They have emotions about it. And just getting them past that is kind of the work of therapy. But once we get there, it’s kind of easily fixed. It takes about six months for a committed couple to cure premature ejaculation. That’s it. And couples stay with this struggle for sometimes decades.

George Faller [00:11:39]:

Again, before we get into the steps, I love how you keep highlighting this as a couple’s problem. This isn’t something broken within the male. This is something that has happens between the two of them. It’s because he wants to please her so much. He feels this pressure. She don’t want to say anything. They don’t know how to communicate it. The negative cycle starts happening. Disconnection, shame increases anxiety increases pressure to perform increases like this is something you got to deal with together. And again, if I Google premature ejaculation, what am I going to see? I’m going to see creams, I’m going to see needles, I’m going to see tools and pumps and all these things that are not addressing the root of the problem, which is the relationship and the disconnection and the anxiety that we’re talking about. So let’s come back, let’s get really practical, and let’s hear how Lori is going to help the couples do this differently in six months for you. Do you want the best orgasm you’ve ever had before?

Laurie Watson [00:12:39]:

I do. I do. Please. For you uses all natural and plant based ingredients to intensify our sexual pleasure. So this is really for women. And you can put it in your vagina. And this helps kind of get absorbed into your body and heightens your orgasm, which is so cool. It’s sort of like an ultimate pleasure pregame because you want to put it on for a little bit before you have sex, maybe 20 minutes. And it does have that warming, sensation inducing kind of botanical that helps you feel more sensitive. It doesn’t burn. I know a lot of you get afraid of that kind of thing, that it burns, but Fouriers Awaken arousal oil and sex oil, they’re the perfect combination for peak pleasure. So you have my permission to try this. I fully endorse you to go ahead and treat yourself, try to have a deeper, fuller orgasm, more pleasure, and start with a bottle of FOIA. FOIA is also offering you, our listeners, 20% off the first order by visiting Foiawellness.com foreplay. Use the code Foreplay at checkout that’s fori.com foreplay for 20% off your first order. And I recommend you using their awaken arousal oil and their sex oil. I think you will thank me.

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George Faller [00:15:33]:

All right. Me and all your listeners are eagerly waiting for these steps. What can we do to kind of do this differently?

Laurie Watson [00:15:41]:

Are you admitting something here, George?

George Faller [00:15:44]:

I have no anxiety. I have no issues, Laurie. So I just speak for my okay.

Laurie Watson [00:15:50]:

Okay. So, first of all, there are some steps, and if your partner is on board and willing to help you, this is all we need. So I would say what we really want to do to start off is generalize pleasure to his whole body. So many men focus on the penis. As I got to get an erection, I got to come all of this. And it’s like I would say, adding foreplay for him, touching him in many different ways and getting him to feel arousal and then stopping him from feeling arousal by maybe lowering the stimulation. Going back to those gears that we talked about sort of cuddling for a while so that he gets used to having an erection and losing an erection. That’s really normal.

George Faller [00:16:40]:

This was a game changer. I do admit to some anxiety. Right. But being able to for me sexually, as I’m being aroused, to feel my heels on the bed, to wiggle my toes, to feel like I really like that, too. As this is happening, as I learned to get more in my body, it was like it made the experience better besides kind of stretching things out. So, again, I love that you’re highlighting this. When you first taught me this, I was like, what is it? That doesn’t seem like a big deal. What a big deal? That is to pay attention to the rest of your body.

Laurie Watson [00:17:18]:

Absolutely. And I think men just need to sort of drink in some pleasure and not feel responsible all the time. I think that’s another thing. I think men tell themselves, I’m responsible for this sexual experience, and it’s difficult to receive and to take. And so we first want them to learn to receive pleasure in many ways.

George Faller [00:17:43]:

Yes. Their whole body, including your feet. Last episode, I talked about my feet. They’re here again. What is going on here, Laurie? With my feet, I’m opening up a whole new part of my sexual being with my feet.

Laurie Watson [00:17:57]:

I am sending you all a twister for Christmas.

George Faller [00:18:00]:

All right.

Laurie Watson [00:18:01]:

Okay. You have to listen back. Okay. Also, definitely, as we said, you focus on erotic thoughts, not the president’s. That is a bad strategy. And I think what we’re saying is, if you have your partner’s cooperation and they have been heard about maybe their disappointment, their sense of rejection, or anything, and that has been processed, then we’re on go. So, first month, I want the men to break all the rules and have an Ejaculation quickly. I want them to do what I say. Go for broke. Like, have fast intercourse. Come as fast as you can.

George Faller [00:18:41]:

Can I turn 30 seconds into 15 seconds?

Laurie Watson [00:18:44]:

Yes, you should. I mean, I think that the men, they have been fighting against this for so long, and that creates anxiety. So I say do it. Do it fast, do it hard, go for it. And then maybe make love with your partner so that she climaxes or whatever, but get it over with. Just do it quickly. I mean, sometimes men tell me, even in month one and this is not part of the plan, but sometimes they say, I had intercourse fast, and then we made love for an hour, and then I was hard again, and I was able to last a little longer. That’s not the point. I just want them to stop fighting this. To give their body permission. Yeah. I want them to feel pleasure. It’s like, go for it. Feel it, enjoy it.

George Faller [00:19:33]:

Do they get a trophy? If they can cut it in half.

Laurie Watson [00:19:35]:

That time, they get a trophy. Absolutely. I have these penis trophies. I send them.

George Faller [00:19:41]:

All right. I like that. 15 seconds. Yes, you can.

Laurie Watson [00:19:49]:

First month, go for broke. Don’t worry about it. Just feel your body. Get back into your body. And this is obviously, the partner knows that this is the instruction, so it’s not about disappointment, and it’s not about him just having his and her not having hers. It’s like, this is just the beginning. Go for it.

George Faller [00:20:09]:

And maybe he has to focus on her pleasure first. She has to have an orgasm to aura or vibrator or something that she feels she’s getting a lot out of the encounter, too. And then go for broke. I like that.

Laurie Watson [00:20:21]:

Yes. Okay, month two, add more foreplay for him. So women need 20 minutes, usually of general foreplay and about 20 minutes of clitoral stimulation. So let’s make sure that he gets tons and tons of foreplay. We sometimes assign sensate focus, which is just exploring each other’s bodies, eventually exploring each other’s bodies naked. And so what I would say to them is have him be touched for, like, 30 minutes at least without any expectation of orgasm. If he does orgasm, that’s cool. Keep touching him. I mean everywhere. Like his face, his hair, his shoulders. Tickle him under his arms or whatever it takes. His belly? Yes. His penis touch and then touch other places and just let him feel and just let what was that?

George Faller [00:21:19]:

You need to get that somehow. Set a timer, man.

Laurie Watson [00:21:23]:

You ruined the mood. You totally ruined the mood.

George Faller [00:21:26]:

That was a good experiential. That timer just went off. Laurie was in the flow. Bam. Just like that. I’m done. I’m done. Lori.

Laurie Watson [00:21:37]:

That’S a bummer. George, he just totally withdrew. I’m like, what was that about?

George Faller [00:21:43]:

Well, it just is. This is why so many women do get frustrated, because they’re in a flow. The connection is starting to grow, it’s starting to thrive. And just like that timer goes off in the morning, it’s over with. It’s jolting to the nervous system.

Laurie Watson [00:21:58]:

It is. Okay, month three, we got to help people in six more minutes. Okay. Month three, I want you to practice edging. Does everybody know what Edging is?

George Faller [00:22:08]:

I can make it six more minutes, Laurie.

Laurie Watson [00:22:11]:

Six.

George Faller [00:22:12]:

Six more minutes. Go. I can do.

Laurie Watson [00:22:17]:

Minutes. George is going to last six minutes. Edging. Do you know what edging is, George?

George Faller [00:22:23]:

Edging. I don’t.

Laurie Watson [00:22:25]:

Okay. Edging is coming very close to orgasm and stopping. So in the beginning, I want him to reach only a level of four or five on a scale of one to ten and then stop stimulation. So he gets aroused, he has an erection. He’s starting to really feel something. And this is pretty early, but most men with premature ejaculation tell me that when I hit a six, I’m at a ten. So I want him to stop before that moment of inevitability. And for men with premature ejaculation, they actually get aroused very early, and they go all the way to the top quickly. So I want him to stop and then relax. And it’s fine if he loses his erection. In fact, I would expect him to lose his erection. So let his body completely relax before you switch to stimulating him again or stimulating her.

George Faller [00:23:19]:

So what might that look like? And again, I love that you use the word relax. It’s so important to less pressure, less anxiety, feeling your body relax. So maybe your partner is stimulating you and you’re getting aroused, and you can feel yourself getting ready to climax. You’re like a five on a one to ten scale for you to be able to kind of stop your wife’s hand and take the hand off the penis. And now maybe you’re going to rub your legs, or you’re going to kind of rub your chest, or you’re going to reach over and kind of rub her chest, and that stopping. The stimulation allows your body to kind of slowly start to calm down, relax. And again, if you lose your erection, that’s fine. But a lot of men, it’s such an intensity that they’re going to hold on to their erection, and they’re just going to take a pause. So is this where a lot of sex therapists talk about the start and stop technique?

Laurie Watson [00:24:13]:

Yeah. So they want to stimulate him, stop, then stimulating him again. He’s going to go over the cliff. He’s going to have a climax eventually. During this month, I want them to try stopping at least twice.

George Faller [00:24:27]:

Okay.

Laurie Watson [00:24:29]:

Month four, you got to increase the stimulation. So some men find oral sex more stimulating, maybe using a slippery lubricant like Uber lube, our sponsor. We do think it’s the best lubricant on the market. Silicone great for him, too. It’s not just to make her not dry. It’s really great for him. So using that and I don’t want them to have intercourse and stop the stimulation. I want them to use something that they find more stimulating and then stop again.

George Faller [00:25:00]:

Okay.

Laurie Watson [00:25:01]:

So, again, working up to stopping twice before he climaxes. So this is oral, hand job, other kinds of stimulation, maybe a toy.

George Faller [00:25:11]:

And that learning to stop starts to help the guy realize they have more control over this.

Laurie Watson [00:25:17]:

It does.

George Faller [00:25:18]:

They have other strategies of backing themselves down.

Laurie Watson [00:25:21]:

This is not a conscious strategy. His brain learns this, right? So most men learn this kind of in their brain early during their sexual life, and they don’t even think about it. So we’re teaching his brain that it’s okay to stop, that he can hold on to that high level of arousal, not climax, it can feel. Okay. He can back down on arousal and then come up again. Okay.

George Faller [00:25:47]:

And a lot of men do this, switching positions, and women often feel frustrated. Why are you switching? Well, they’re switching because they’re trying to back themselves down.

Laurie Watson [00:25:56]:

Interesting information. I didn’t know that. Okay. Very interesting. Okay, month five, intravaginal containment.

George Faller [00:26:06]:

And this is when that sounds sexy.

Laurie Watson [00:26:10]:

Such a sexy way to say it, right? My article, I will say, is so awesome.

George Faller [00:26:15]:

Containment. That was pretty good. What the hell is that? Laurie, please explain.

Laurie Watson [00:26:22]:

Get Insider. That’s what it is. But what I want him to do is to fully enter her and rest. Just stay there so that he can feel his penis enveloped, feel the warmth of her vagina, the slipperiness of it. Feel all that good connection. And maybe they can lie there and talk to each other, maybe make eye contact and just rest. So no thrusting, which I would imagine.

George Faller [00:26:50]:

Very frustrated while he’s in there.

Laurie Watson [00:26:52]:

No moving. Because if she moves right, it’s the same as thrusting. It’s going to drive him crazy and he’s going to climax. But I mean, after he stops for a period of time, how long you do that?

George Faller [00:27:05]:

Six minutes.

Laurie Watson [00:27:10]:

Maybe just a okay. Okay. And then he should climax.

George Faller [00:27:15]:

Okay. I never heard of that before.

Laurie Watson [00:27:17]:

Yeah. intervaginal containment. George, you’re going to ask Kathy, can we do some intervaginal containment tonight?

George Faller [00:27:25]:

Good luck with that one.

Laurie Watson [00:27:29]:

Really sexy. Okay. Vaginal thrusting. Yay. This is it. This is it. So what I want them to try, though, is not thrusting to climax, but thrusting and stopping. So maybe two or three times, resting again, enjoying being inside her, enjoying him being inside her.

George Faller [00:27:54]:

So when he stops, she has to stop.

Laurie Watson [00:27:56]:

Yes, george, if she stops, this is.

George Faller [00:28:00]:

Why you need a partner. This is what you need, communication. Because if you stop it, all of a sudden she’s like, what’s going on? And she keeps moving. And you’re going to have problems here.

Laurie Watson [00:28:11]:

Yes. This might be good. Like a female on top so that she’s the one moving and then stops. Maybe he can’t stop himself. So this one could be good with her on top, her moving and then.

George Faller [00:28:25]:

Her stopping, which is maybe why lots of men describe easier to control when she’s on top.

Laurie Watson [00:28:32]:

Yeah, he doesn’t quite have the same range of motion in his hips. It’s another reason men don’t climax with oral sex sometimes, because they can’t thrust. So, yeah, thrusting, I get it. They need to thrust thrusting. Okay. And then after he rests for a period of time, thrusting to climax. Just seeing if they can do that twice. Eventually at the end of the month, even if it’s only one thrust rest, one thrust rest and then climax. That would be awesome.

George Faller [00:29:08]:

I love it.

Laurie Watson [00:29:09]:

Or she’s on top, one movement down, rest.

George Faller [00:29:13]:

The Lori Watson six month guarantee, folks. Take those. A lot of a lot of wisdom there and really helping people know the problem between the two people and the solution being between the two of them and working together, it’s the most natural thing to do to get us in more relaxed states. We just need help in doing it. So thank you for that help, Lori.

Laurie Watson [00:29:35]:

You’re welcome. And it kind of sounds like fun, right? I mean, this six months kind of sounds like fun.

George Faller [00:29:41]:

I’m signing up for some intervaginal containment or whatever the heck you call it. Here we go.

Laurie Watson [00:29:48]:

Okay, keep it hot.

George Faller [00:29:50]:

Keep it hot, y’all.

Laurie Watson [00:29:52]:

Okay. So tell us about your cutting edge training that you’re doing on success and vulnerability.

George Faller [00:29:57]:

Laurie we just keep pushing it. Coming up with a new module on the playbook of a pursuer, playbook of a witch, or really practical moment by moment moves of what a therapist can use. We’re so focused on what’s happening in session enough, there’s talk about theories and these global things I think most therapists are looking for, what do I do in this moment? Give me a tool, George. So that’s what we’re trying to do.

Laurie Watson [00:30:23]:

That’s awesome. I am so glad you guys are doing this work. I think it helps us be organized to see you do it. You do demos, you do explanations. Teaching, it really is interactive, and I think that so many trainings that we sit through don’t give us an opportunity for that. So what you’re doing is really important.

George Faller [00:30:43]:

No, we try to emphasize, to teach it, show it, do it model of learning. You need to have some ideas. So we try to teach those, and then we try to show what it looks like implementing those ideas. But most importantly, you now got to practice it. That’s how they become yours. And that’s what we want our listeners and watchers to do, is become their own moves.

Laurie Watson [00:31:01]:

Find George and his [email protected].

George Faller [00:31:06]:

Call in your questions to the foreplay. Question voicemail dial eight three three. My Foreplay. That’s eight. Three, three my the number four play and we’ll use the questions for our mailbag episodes. All content is for entertainment purposes only and should not be considered as a substitute for therapy by a licensed clinician or as medical advice from a doctor. This podcast is copyrighted by Foreplay Media.