Join Laurie and George today as they talk about the Care Giving cycle and how important it is for our partners and relationships to respond with care to our partner’s needs, both expressed and unexpressed.
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Uberlube.com — Laurie’s favorite personal lubricant!
Transcript
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Speaker D [00:01:37]:
The following content is not suitable for children.
Laurie Watson [00:01:39]:
George this new year we’ve got lots of things that we need to discuss and talk about and I am very interested now in some of your thoughts about the caretaking cycle. We have the sexual cycle, the emotional cycle, and we’re going to talk about the caregiving cycle. Let’s do this.
George Faller [00:01:55]:
Let’s roll baby.
Laurie Watson [00:01:59]:
Welcome to Foreplay sex therapy. I’m Dr. Lori Watson, your sex therapist.
George Faller [00:02:04]:
And I’m George Fow, couples therapist.
Laurie Watson [00:02:06]:
We are here to talk about sex.
George Faller [00:02:08]:
Our mission is to help couples talk about sex in ways that incorporate their body, their mind and their hearts.
Laurie Watson [00:02:16]:
And we have a little bit of fun doing it right G listen and.
George Faller [00:02:20]:
Let’S change some relationships, okay?
Laurie Watson [00:02:22]:
And we’re teaching in Arkansas with the Arkansas EFT community. Thank you Ryan, Reina and all. We’re excited to come see you and It’ll be a two day training in February 27th and the 28th.
George Faller [00:02:36]:
Check it out at Arkansas eft.com. go Hogs, baby.
Laurie Watson [00:02:42]:
Okay, we’re excited.
George Faller [00:02:43]:
Come see, y’.
Laurie Watson [00:02:43]:
All.
Speaker H [00:02:45]:
Okay.
Laurie Watson [00:02:45]:
The caregiving cycle.
George Faller [00:02:46]:
Caregiving. Here we go. It’s. It is interesting as we’re writing this book and we get more into the history of attachment theory. And it has always talked about caregiving, emotional attachment system and sexual. Right. And the emotional and the sexual are our needs, and caregiving is the reciprocal response to those needs. So you really.
George Faller [00:03:09]:
That’s what you’re trying to line up. Baby cries. That’s their emotion. Attachment needs. I’m scared. I’m tired. It primes the caregiving part of the parent to kind of pick that child up. And then that’s this beautiful process that we’re tapping into.
George Faller [00:03:23]:
I think what happens with most couples if we’re Joey and Janie here, right? And Janie wants to talk to me about something that’s bugging her, that I’m not around enough when she shares her emotional attachment system, it triggers my emotional attachment system to me. Like, now I’m being criticized. This doesn’t feel fair. It’s a threat. And my emotional attachment system wants to protect itself. Well, when emotional attachment systems are activated, it blocks the caregiver. So you see both people. It’s like a baby’s crying, yet they can’t get the caregiver in response.
George Faller [00:03:56]:
That they need to actually feel safe and to heal and to, you know, so really being intentional. I have these hats that my couples wear. So here it is. I’m showing Laurie the red hat is the emotional attachment system. Like, all right, Lori, you’re the one. You’re sharing. You’re the mission. You want to talk about something that’s bothering you.
George Faller [00:04:15]:
It’s really important for your partner to put on the blue hat, the caregiving system, right? There’s not the time to talk about you and get defensive. It’s really that. That openness that says, let me walk in my partner’s shoes. Let me, you know, figure out their world. You know, the timing isn’t right for my stuff. I’ll get to that later. And it’s really helpful, you know, for couples without therapists, you know, at home, to start having these conversations, say, hey, babe, can I have your caregiving system just for five minutes? But it really tells the other person what the mission here, what the job is. A lot of times you can’t do it because we’re human and we get triggered.
George Faller [00:04:49]:
But it is really, I think, helpful to. To know what it is we’re looking for and what we want from our partner to communicate that. We talk a lot on this show about mission, mission, mission, but even that isn’t clear what the mission is. The mission is I want your caregiving system. I want my partner to understand me and come closer. Right. And so that’s what we’re going to practice today.
Laurie Watson [00:05:11]:
Yeah, I think, you know, what you’re saying is the caregiving cycle, though it is certainly a gift, it is part of how we meet our partner and get triggered in a positive way to have those feelings of, okay, I want to take care of you, you’re hurting, I want to come to you. But it also has a need too. Right. I need my partner in the caregiving cycle to come to me. It’s both. There is a push and a pull. And I also think sort of my understanding of the caregiving cycle is it’s also about loyalty, you know, commitment. Those things are part of the caregiving cycle as well.
Laurie Watson [00:05:49]:
That, you know, I want you to have my back. I want you to also kind of know if I’m hurting to be aware of that. You know, when I met my mother in laws and she criticizes the dish I brought, I want you to, you know, stand up for me and say, hey, I like the potatoes or whatever it is, you know, there’s, it’s a complex system.
George Faller [00:06:13]:
Well, the want is the emotional attachment system. The given of the want is the caregiving system. So if we want, if I want my partner to have my back, my partner having my back is the caregiving system. Right. That is exactly what builds trust when those two systems are aligned. And that’s, you know, that’s the beautiful simplicity of the process. I always remind myself, baby crying, parent picks it up. You know, I want my partner to listen, my partner listens.
George Faller [00:06:39]:
I want my partner to have my back, my partner has my back. Right. When you come in, your grandma or your mother in law, whoever makes the comment about the plate, having your partners say, hey, listen, it’s a beautiful plate, like just knowing that your partner is there to support you. That is the beauty of the caregiving system in action.
Laurie Watson [00:06:57]:
But I think what I’m saying is baby crying is need for caregiving.
George Faller [00:07:02]:
Yes.
Laurie Watson [00:07:02]:
Parent meeting is the caregiving cycle too. It is slightly separate. I mean, there is a system, it’s not just one way. I thought I heard you say that. It’s just kind of my caregiving system gets activated to give, which it does. But my caregiving cycle also gets activated in my need, not Just my emotional stuff.
George Faller [00:07:26]:
Well, these systems always into. Into playing. Right. But when that caregiving system, when you also need back. That is now your emotional system being activated.
Laurie Watson [00:07:34]:
No, I think that’s the caregiving cycle. I think that’s the caregiving cycle. When I need. When I. It’s. There’s a separateness in it. When I need you to be loyal to me, when I need to know you’re committed, when I need you to pick up, that’s the caregiving cycle.
George Faller [00:07:52]:
This is where we confuse our listeners, which is cool because this is how we all get, you know, clearer.
Laurie Watson [00:07:58]:
And I don’t think I’m confusing our listeners. I think I see it differently.
George Faller [00:08:04]:
I mean, that’s both of us seeing it differently. It’s probably confusing to our listeners, but it’s okay.
Laurie Watson [00:08:10]:
Yeah. I mean, we’re working this out together. We’re trying to understand each other. And we do that so well.
George Faller [00:08:18]:
Yes, we do.
Laurie Watson [00:08:20]:
George is like, wait, that’s not what I think. And I’m like, that’s not what I think.
George Faller [00:08:26]:
Simpler. And you’re usually got a little bit more layers of complexity, which is both of them.
Laurie Watson [00:08:31]:
Okay. I think of it as in the emotional cycle. I mean, caregiving, it’s a bit hard to split off, right. Because it is about our feelings of need, which is similar to our feelings of need. Well, in either cycle, really. But George is shaking his head. He’s like, no, I don’t think that. Okay.
George Faller [00:08:54]:
Anytime you use the word. Anytime you use the word need, you’re talking about the emotional system. The caregiving is a response to the need. That’s the reciprocal part of it. Caregiving is to give in to the need. So, you know, when you have your partner’s back and you’re given that reassurance, you’re giving that comfort, you’re giving that empathy, you’re giving that love. That is the caregiving system.
Laurie Watson [00:09:14]:
Certainly. Certainly the gift is the caregiving cycle.
George Faller [00:09:17]:
Right. And when you then need back, that is your emotional system. That’s part of the caregiving. But the, the needing that you. That you look at need and response, that’s the two systems interplay.
Laurie Watson [00:09:28]:
Yeah, I don’t quite see it that way. I see it as the caregiving cycle. The way I understand it from. From what I’ve read is just. It’s like different kinds of needs. It is the need for loyalty, commitment, having your back, tenderness. I mean, it is. I see it as slightly different than.
George Faller [00:09:51]:
That which we’re going to get back to you all as we continue to get Clearer on that.
Laurie Watson [00:09:56]:
Okay.
George Faller [00:09:57]:
Right.
George Faller [00:09:57]:
Because we are saying different things. Lori’s saying the need to caregive. Right. Is part of that cycle, part of the caregiving system. I would say that that is the emotional system coming into the caregiving system. So back to the hats. What I would.
Laurie Watson [00:10:15]:
Back to the hat.
George Faller [00:10:16]:
I see this a lot.
Laurie Watson [00:10:17]:
Are we gonna sell these hats?
George Faller [00:10:18]:
We are. Next thing to happen.
Laurie Watson [00:10:22]:
Okay.
George Faller [00:10:22]:
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George Faller [00:11:54]:
A lot of times, you know, when I’m working with families, this is exactly what’s happening. You know, the kid wants to talk about something and then the parent wants to talk the kid out of it. Disagrees because what the kid is saying, you know, doesn’t make sense given their perspective.
Laurie Watson [00:12:13]:
Even our adult kids, this happens a lot, right?
George Faller [00:12:17]:
So give an example. I was in session. The kid says, you know, I really don’t like your text when you check in and you say, hey, you know, how are you doing? Like he reads in that, how are you doing? Like a check it in. Like implying that he’s doing something wrong or like giving a report. And especially boys, they’ve been trained their whole life or they’re being checked up on. It’s usually not a good thing, right? So it’s not even a decision. It’s like mom’s text says, how’s it going? And he’s like, oh boy, I don’t even want to answer this text. You know? So he has the emotional hat where like, what’s that like for you when you get that text? He’s like, I feel like I’m in trouble.
George Faller [00:12:55]:
I feel like. And then a mom jumps in. That’s not what I mean at all. I mean, I’m just, I’m interested in you, I care about you. I’m just checking in with you. Right? That’s her own emotions kind of getting triggered by his misinterpretation of her good intent, right? So then she jumps in and tells him he’s doing it wrong, which is exactly what his brain expects to happen around these conversations. That’s the self fulfilling loop of a negative cycle. So I got to be ready to say, hold on, hold on, mom, because again, you have a beautiful intent and you’re initiating a text because you want this connection, right? But you got your caregiver hat on.
George Faller [00:13:29]:
You’re trying to understand, why does my son not see what I’m trying to do? You need to be curious about how he might take it a different way than you meant it. So can we try that again? Can you try to be curious about why maybe he hears in a message criticism that you don’t intend when I can get the mom to do that. So in this case, mom tries again and she’s like, well, I guess I do know what it’s like when my mom used to do things like that to me. And I, I didn’t like it. So, all right, tell me more. And she starts a. Curiosity is the key word to a caregiving system. When you’re curious, the system is open.
George Faller [00:14:02]:
When you’re not, you know, defensiveness blocks that caregiver response. So mom tries again. Son goes back and he’s like, you know, I get like, you know, nervous and I don’t know how to talk about it.
Speaker H [00:14:14]:
And.
George Faller [00:14:14]:
And then I’m afraid if I do talk about it, you’re not going to understand it. Mom jumps in, I won’t understand I’m good at talking about feelings. Again, her emotional system blocking her caregiving system. So, you know, with. Usually what I’m inviting all our listeners to think about is when one person interrupts, I stop them in my session. I say, hold on. Is this interrupt interruption going to help our mission, which is to understand in this person’s emotional system, or is it going to introduce something new? What you’re going to see the majority of the time is the interruption is the other partner introducing their own emotional attachment system. And when you’re doing that, not only is the timing wrong for the other person, it’s blocking your caregiving.
George Faller [00:14:57]:
Right. Which is what starts setting up a negative cycle. What do you think?
Laurie Watson [00:15:03]:
I think it sounds complicated. It’s probably, probably for me, some of what you’ve said in terms of curiosity, that I agree that in any cycle where we’re working in sexual, emotional, or caregiving, you know, curiosity is the antidote to defensiveness, to kind of rigidity, to all of that. Right. If we can somehow force our mind to say, okay, I’m stuck here. I can feel it in my body. There’s a block. You know, if we can kind of say, okay, if I can get curious that there’s something logical in the other person, there’s something that makes sense to them, then we can figure it out. And that’s kind of an act of the will to say, okay, this isn’t working.
Laurie Watson [00:15:54]:
You know, I’m not getting the response I expected, so I got to get curious as to why exactly.
George Faller [00:16:00]:
That’s what we would call. Right, openness and defensiveness. If the emotional system is open, you send a clear signal about your need. Sexual system is open. You express what you need in a clear way. Caregiving is open. We respond. That’s.
George Faller [00:16:13]:
That’s the beauty of the systems being open. But the defensiveness shuts them down.
Laurie Watson [00:16:17]:
Don’t we also send a clear signal in our caregiving system? It’s not just response, it has to be asked.
George Faller [00:16:23]:
Yeah, that is a clear signal, but.
Laurie Watson [00:16:25]:
It’S not coming from the emotional cycle. It’s coming from the caregiving cycle. That’s where I think I’m differing here in terms of my understanding that there has to be the push, pull in the caregiving cycle as well.
George Faller [00:16:41]:
Yeah, that’s exactly what we’re trying to figure out here. And that’s what we use these podcasts, right, to try to work through.
Laurie Watson [00:16:47]:
We got to figure out some concepts.
George Faller [00:16:49]:
To me, there is no, there is no need in the caregiving system. It is 100%. The responsiveness to the needs, the two systems that need a sexual emotional and the responsiveness, the loop that completes it. It’s the response to it needs is a different one. And what Lori say clearly is she sees needs as part of the caregiver system.
Laurie Watson [00:17:09]:
Right?
George Faller [00:17:10]:
And it’s looking for something to, to. To feel safe and to do its job. And, you know, this is what we’re trying to figure out. So let’s come back and we’ll talk about applying this in the sexual cycles.
Laurie Watson [00:17:21]:
Okay?
George Faller [00:17:21]:
What that looks like.
George Faller [00:17:26]:
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Laurie Watson [00:17:48]:
You can use it for sex in the shower.
George Faller [00:17:50]:
Go ahead and explore all those mermaid fantasies.
Laurie Watson [00:17:53]:
Seriously.
George Faller [00:17:53]:
You can use it with condoms.
Laurie Watson [00:17:55]:
It’s okay.
George Faller [00:17:55]:
With latex. You can even use Uber Lube for chafe, protection against sports. I’m serious. You can buy little travel packets so.
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Laurie Watson [00:18:33]:
Okay, George, These are new concepts that we’re trying to wrap our brain around as we explain what happens between people and how they bond, how they connect, how they repair. So I, you know, I’m interested in what you’re saying. You’ve read some different things than I’ve read, and I’m definitely going to get on those. Go again, like in the sexual cycle, how do you see the caregiving part of us? The part that wants to care for, be tender, to, you know, be involved with, like, you know, hold that person. Like what? How does that work in the sexual cycle? Do you see?
George Faller [00:19:10]:
Yeah, I think a lot of times before I get into that, I mean, again, our process and hopefully, who knows, maybe there’s some listeners here that are attachment theory experts and they give us feedback. I mean, we really believe in opening up a space to have conversations, to recognize there’s a lot of different ways again to the same place and different perspectives, and it’s how we get clearer. We’re inviting that feedback. And it’s what Laurie and I do a lot, you know, with each other, which is, you know, I think, part of what helps both of us continue to grow. So there’s not like a fight, right or wrong. It’s just like, you know, we see things differently, and that’s cool. And how do we, you know, start using that to make our message clearer? You know, when I think typically in a. In a sexual cycle, you know, if you think of Joey and Janie, Joey starting out with his sexual system open, he wants to have sex.
George Faller [00:19:59]:
It’s his main way of connecting. He initiates having sex. Right. And a lot of times, I think the female partner, not being driven by testosterone, being kind of stressed through the day, like, might not be in a place where their sexual system is ready to respond. It’s not, like, prime and have all this desire. I think a lot of women respond out of a caregiver that’s like, you know, I. I know this is important to my husband. I want to respond to my husband.
George Faller [00:20:25]:
And it’s caregiving that allows them to put their body in a space where things will kind of start to turn on, you know, And I think that’s a beautiful thing to do, like to. To have sex not knowing and just doing it, you know, to respond to love your partner.
Laurie Watson [00:20:40]:
Yes. So, I mean, I think we’ve said this in the past, and we’re not talking about doing it when you don’t want to. We’re talking about doing it you want to because of another reason. Not necessarily physiological desire or arousal or even sexual want. You’re doing it because you want to love your partner. That love is your motive. That’s the beginning. And you’re saying, okay, that piece is taking care of your partner, and that’s an okay motive.
Laurie Watson [00:21:10]:
And it does, like you said, you know, a lot of women, they don’t feel desire first. So being in the space where they’re being touched, being stimulated, you know, they might actually turn on. And that’s really a good thing. But they. They give themselves that opportunity when they begin from love.
George Faller [00:21:29]:
Exactly.
Laurie Watson [00:21:30]:
Yeah.
Speaker D [00:21:30]:
Yeah.
George Faller [00:21:31]:
And if they. If their sexual system comes online, you know, then both sexual systems are open and doing their thing. And it’s beautiful. Right. If it doesn’t come online and you’re just having Sex for the other person, that’s where it can stop becoming a problem. Right. And that’s, you know, you start off with the caregiving open, but before you know it, you’re feeling pretty disconnected. You feel like you’re feeling pain in your body.
George Faller [00:21:55]:
You feel like your partner’s using your body. Now your emotional system is. Is taking over the space in a defensive place. And that’s. That can be traumatic. I mean, that’s. We’re trying to help couples talk about that. You know, to push your body through that is training it not to want to have sex.
George Faller [00:22:09]:
Right. So really notice. And it starts off as caregiving, but if your body starts to really go to some bad places, you know, your caregiving is probably offline, and you’re now struggling in that. Your own emotional kind of darkness in that. Think some of the loneliest moments couples have described to me has been it started off with a nice caregiving intent, and it ended in a traumatic way where they felt disconnected and really lonely and laying next to that partner.
Laurie Watson [00:22:36]:
I know that is probably the saddest thing between a couple right after making love. They, you know, they’re not making love. They just had something happen and they don’t feel connected at all. That is really a sad thing.
George Faller [00:22:51]:
Yeah. And like, I know even for me and my personal relationship, having this, like these three understanding what I’m looking for, you know, that I do want, you know, maintenance sex. I just want a stress relief like my. My. It’s. My body’s just looking for that connectional thing. And there isn’t a lot of emotional elements, but sometimes, you know, the emotions are driving the sex. I really want that intimacy.
George Faller [00:23:14]:
I really want that deeper connection. I really want to, you know, look at my wife and like, you know, so I think there’s different combinations and different obviously types of sex. But it helps me to say, like, what. What am I looking for? What’s driving it? The need? Is it simply pleasure? Is it simply stress reduction? Is it more physiological? Might be that sexual release? Is it more emotional? And the flip side of it is, like, when is my caregiving? It could be so easy for my wife to want to talk about something, and my. My brain would be disagree with that and want to talk about something else. That’s my making my emotional needs more important than us, right? So, like, taking a moment, say, wait a second, she’s starting this conversation. She wants my caregiving system, Fine, let’s give her my caregiving system. It makes it so much easier for me to kind of stay Present instead of kind of bouncing all over the place.
Laurie Watson [00:24:08]:
Okay. So sometimes, George, you know, you’re aware of yourself. Like, you’re not necessarily looking for intimate sex. You’re just like, it’s been a rough day, tension release. I just want to have an orgasm. And. And then other times, it’s really about intimacy and connection to your wife and being present with her. I have a question for you about that.
Laurie Watson [00:24:35]:
In those different types of sex in the caregiving cycle. So let’s say you want maintenance sex, but how does the, like, maybe that’s not going to be great for your wife. How does the caregiving cycle, like, you know, deal with your wife’s needs, given it’s a quickie or it’s, you know, like, help me understand that little.
George Faller [00:25:02]:
The caregiving is the responding to her caregiving. Right. Which is saying, you know, hey, I know we didn’t have a lot of time for you tonight. I love that you’re kind of willing to put my needs first. I’m so lucky to have such an amazing wife and partner, you know? You know, it’s that affirmation. It’s that. And usually afterwards for. For me and for most men, it’s like they’re the most emotional after an orgasm, right in the afterglow period.
George Faller [00:25:29]:
It’s like, you know, I want to cuddle, I want to rub your hair. I want to tell you how beautiful you are. Like, a lot of those emotional needs are going. It’s easier for me to access that. My. When my caregiving system is open, the sexual system opens up my caregiving system. Right. And it makes me much more present to be able to respond.
George Faller [00:25:47]:
Where if we don’t have sex and she rolls over, I get all frustrated. I feel rejected. I can’t access that kind of caregiving part to her. So does that make sense? How might mean that valid, that affirmation, that appreciation, you know, even if it is a quickie, you know, and she don’t get her sexual needs maybe met, you know, she can get her emotional needs met. Right. And that’s still going to be a win for her if that’s acknowledged. But if I just go to bed and I don’t access my caregiving system, I just fall asleep. Like, that’s going to probably leave her in a tough spot.
Laurie Watson [00:26:21]:
That would leave her in a tough spot for sure. Yeah. So many ideas here are, you know, flying through my head. So, okay, if you have a quickie and her sexual needs are not met, but perhaps the quickie for her is also about not Necessarily needing sexual needs to be met. It’s about giving to you and when.
George Faller [00:26:42]:
You appreciate the given right, that gratitude for the given, the thankfulness for the given. I think that is my caregiving system trying to give back.
Laurie Watson [00:26:52]:
Sure.
Speaker J [00:26:54]:
This episode is brought to you by Diet Coke. You know that moment when you just need to hit pause and refresh. An ice cold Diet Coke isn’t just a break. It’s your chance to catch your breath and savor a moment that’s all about you. Always refreshing. Still the same great taste. Diet Coke make time for you time.
Speaker H [00:27:12]:
This episode is brought to you by. Oops. I’ve got a box of Cheez It Crackers staring at me and I just wanted that irresistible Cheesy crunch. Sorry, that was a total snackcident.
Laurie Watson [00:27:23]:
Mmm.
Speaker H [00:27:24]:
What was I supposed to be talking about? So salty, so crunchy. So cheesy. Whoops. Lost my train of thought. I’ve heard of brain freeze, but brain cheese? I’ll just have one more cheesy cracker and then I’ll get back to it.
George Faller [00:27:42]:
And I think my partner would really appreciate being seen being, you know, acknowledged that, you know, maybe she wouldn’t have been her night, but she was still willing to do that for me. And that’s what love is, that, that kind of sacrifice. Part of it. But in sacrifice, we feel better about ourselves that we can be there for our partner. We got our partners back. We know that’s important.
George Faller [00:28:04]:
Sure.
Laurie Watson [00:28:04]:
Anytime we give love in an altruistic way, it does actually bolster our self esteem, you know, because that’s, that’s being human. Right. That’s being above our base needs to, to sort of, in a spiritual sense do more for somebody else than is, than could be done for ourselves. So I, I agree with you. I agree with you.
George Faller [00:28:28]:
That was a beautiful line. I just want to highlight it. When you said given in an altruistic way, I mean that is the caregiving definition right there. You’re giving, you’re responding to these needs in an altruistic way because you love the other person and you want their needs to be met. And that it just is. That is not just good for the person getting their needs met. It feels pretty wonderful. I mean, we know his parents right.
George Faller [00:28:52]:
When we could take care of our parents, kids. That feels pretty amazing. You’re always talking about your grandkids. You know, they’re sick and they’re cranking, they’re crying, they’re throwing up and you’re rocking them and you’re like, it feel amazing. Right.
Laurie Watson [00:29:04]:
It’s like the best day of the week. Right. Just taking care of my sick grandson is just like the very best day of the week.
George Faller [00:29:11]:
Just to.
Laurie Watson [00:29:12]:
Yeah, I mean, I, I don’t care that he spits up on me, that it, you know, there’s snot all over me that I’m going to get sick too. It’s like, it’s this amazing, wonderful part to give. And I think all of us, this is, this is why, you know, we’re trained as children give to charities, because it’s not just doing our part. It actually makes us feel better. We’re improving the world. This is, this is the human part. It’s not just, you know, I’m going to give you 50% and you give 50% and, you know, then we’re even.
George Faller [00:29:46]:
It’s not about that.
Laurie Watson [00:29:46]:
Right. In a relationship, it’s not about being even. It’s about loving and caring. Certainly we need to represent our needs, but it’s also about taking care of, which is that spiritual part of the relationship. I care about us more than I care about me.
George Faller [00:30:07]:
And these systems, the beauty of them, they work in balance. So if you’re listening, you’re saying, huh, I don’t think I do that much of that. That’s probably because you’re good at asking for your needs, but you’re not so good at the caregiving system of responding to that. And you’re missing the opportunity to see the gift of giving, which feels pretty amazing.
Laurie Watson [00:30:23]:
Yes.
George Faller [00:30:23]:
The other side of it is you’re going to have people who give too much. Right. And they can’t ask for their needs to be met. So how do we that balance?
Laurie Watson [00:30:30]:
Yes. I think the, the main point is that we know vulnerability triggers our partner’s caregiving cycle, and that’s a good thing. So it’s both. Right. Curiosity allows us the space to give care, and vulnerability triggers our partner’s caregiving.
George Faller [00:30:50]:
Right.
Laurie Watson [00:30:50]:
I mean, unfortunately, think about the way that that’s been misused. Right. The damsel in distress, you know, that’s a hook for men. I’m incapable. I need you. I can’t manage on my own. And men step in there with the caregiving part. I mean, I suppose it’s a trigger for women too, Right.
Laurie Watson [00:31:12]:
Because you know, the guy who can’t manage his life or can’t. It’s really the, it’s the hook for the withdrawer. You know, it’s like she’s like, I can help him understand himself. You know, that’s the caregiving part, which annoys the hell out of men.
George Faller [00:31:30]:
Often so many women that are hysterical, they can’t because they’re always in need and emotion. They never can get the groundedness that comes from being able to caregive their partner.
Laurie Watson [00:31:41]:
Right.
George Faller [00:31:41]:
It’s. And creates such an imbalance that blocks.
Laurie Watson [00:31:45]:
In the beginning, it’s so it works. But over time, everybody says, I need care too.
George Faller [00:31:53]:
Gotta have it.
Laurie Watson [00:31:54]:
Gotta have it.
George Faller [00:31:54]:
You gotta give it. I mean, we talk about it getting it all the time, but it’s giving it too. That’s super important.
Laurie Watson [00:32:00]:
Being able to give is. Is self growth. Right. We have to develop. I mean, that’s what makes us a good parent, is we are altruistic when we don’t want to be.
George Faller [00:32:10]:
And a lot of pursuers can’t give it because they’re drowning in their own pain and a lot of withdrawals can’t give it because they’re so protective and shutting themselves up that both of them are deprived of caregiving.
Laurie Watson [00:32:21]:
Yeah. But I just. I think what we want people to know is that when they’re in a stressful conflict, what they need to do.
George Faller [00:32:33]:
To bring care online.
Laurie Watson [00:32:34]:
And care is a loving act.
George Faller [00:32:37]:
Right.
Laurie Watson [00:32:37]:
To bring that online, they have to get curious if they feel blocked. And to help your partner understand you better, you actually have to show your underbelly.
George Faller [00:32:49]:
You have to be vulnerable.
George Faller [00:32:52]:
Yeah. I mean, if you want to keep that simple. The emotional system is based on need. It’s on me. What I need. It’s on I. The caregiver is focused on the partner. And given.
George Faller [00:33:03]:
It’s focused on you. That’s what you’re trying to. I need and you’re focused on me. You give it to me. Right. If you’re focused on yourself, it shows your caregiving system is blocked.
Laurie Watson [00:33:14]:
Okay, but one last point before we quit, George. When I’m thinking about your wife there, who’s given to you in a quickie, let’s say, say yeah. And you’re giving back to her appreciation.
George Faller [00:33:25]:
In the caregiving cycle.
Laurie Watson [00:33:28]:
She actually needs something in the caregiving cycle. She needs to be recognized, taken care of with that appreciation. That. That is part of her need in the caregiving cycle.
George Faller [00:33:38]:
I would say that’s the. Her emotional part needing that.
Laurie Watson [00:33:41]:
Okay. Okay. We got a. We got a lot to figure out.
George Faller [00:33:45]:
That’s exactly what that is. It’s these. I give and then like wanting that appreciation back. That’s my emotional system needing. And that’s the beauty system to work.
Laurie Watson [00:33:57]:
We got lots to talk about here. We got lots to talk about. Okay. Okay. Y’ all thanks for bearing with us as George and I argue. And I gotta say, you know, I know we look pretty smooth on this podcast, but sometimes when we’re developing theory and trying to understand, we argue pretty vigorously about, you know, what we feel and what we think and this is how we get better and sharper. So thanks for listening to us.
George Faller [00:34:23]:
Keep it hot, y’. All.
Speaker D [00:34:26]:
Call in your Questions to the 4Play question voicemail. Dial 833-MY-4PLAY. That’s 833-MY- the number 4Play, and we’ll use the questions for our mailbag episodes. All content is for entertainment purposes only and should not be considered as a substitute for therapy by a licensed clinician or as medical advice from a doctor. This podcast is copyrighted by Foreplay Media.
George Faller [00:34:47]:
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Laurie Watson [00:35:03]:
A price that actually makes sense.
George Faller [00:35:05]:
I am giving every son of mine one of their cashmere scarves and I’m giving my daughter in laws the cashmere sweaters. Different varieties. But I’m so, so excited. And I am of course wearing cashmere.
Laurie Watson [00:35:18]:
Sweaters for the holidays because I’m going.
George Faller [00:35:20]:
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